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    <title>Middletown City Council</title>
    <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/list.php?80</link>
    <description><![CDATA[Talk about issues facing the Middletown City Council.]]></description>
    <language>EN</language>
    <pubDate>Mon, 18 Aug 2008 13:27:10 -0400</pubDate>
    <lastBuildDate>Mon, 18 Aug 2008 13:27:10 -0400</lastBuildDate>
    <category>Middletown City Council</category>
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    <item>
      <title>Re: It's Only $300.</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67493,67540#msg-67540</link>
      <author>The Watchdog</author>
      <description><![CDATA[vette, I agree the city wastes enormous amounts of money, but don't think this is one of them. Ohio changed consumer law statutes because mortgage brokers were committing fraud on many consumers. A friend of mine is a real estate attorney with a large firm in Ohio, and the stories of fraud are surreal. Lets worry more about the fact the city is using $50K plus of funds for the east end, while doing nothing to our roads where we live. Not many out living in the Renaissance, and I can't even get them to seal the cracks in our neighborhood. What did Husemann do to earn his $75K? Well, he helped appoint the police chief &quot;of choice&quot; and found a city manager. That bothers me far more than $300.00. I understand your point however, but there was alot of fraud in lending. Undoubtedly, a fixed rate structure is always superior than variable, but when you are misled,you have a right and remedy to have it corrected.]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67493,67540#msg-67540</guid>
      <pubDate>Mon, 18 Aug 2008 13:27:10 -0400</pubDate>
    </item>
    <item>
      <title>Re: It's Only $300.</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67493,67538#msg-67538</link>
      <author>80corvette</author>
      <description><![CDATA[Disagreement accepted. I guess I was trying to concentrate on the aspect of money being spent by the city and if the city was, in the end, going to pay much more than the $300, as was originally advertised. I can see your points in your response, but I still believe that the people funding these public services( the busses), shouldn't pay the bill to transport other people, who made bad financial decisions, to bail them out of their predicament. Let them take responsibility for getting to the program.They need to learn responsibility sometime.They sure didn't learn it when they purchased that house they can no longer afford. I bought a new home in 2005. I didn't allow myself to be exploited by predatory lending and would only accept a fixed rate. It's just common sense.]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67493,67538#msg-67538</guid>
      <pubDate>Mon, 18 Aug 2008 12:56:01 -0400</pubDate>
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    <item>
      <title>Re: It's Only $300.</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67493,67536#msg-67536</link>
      <author>The Watchdog</author>
      <description><![CDATA[Disagreement vette. Any investment which avoids putting less inventory in an already saturated market benefits everyone. I also know many who were exposed to predatory lending practices, including some college educated individuals. I think this was a worthy investment. I agreed with the help the feds gave Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae, because the more glut on market, the lower the value of houses. 10% vacancy in Middletown market, with years to go before its bought. That $300.00 was chump change and it benefits everyone.]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67493,67536#msg-67536</guid>
      <pubDate>Mon, 18 Aug 2008 12:05:53 -0400</pubDate>
    </item>
    <item>
      <title>It's Only $300.</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67493,67493#msg-67493</link>
      <author>80corvette</author>
      <description><![CDATA[Journal article about bussing people who plan to attend the Borrower Outreach event from 2-8PM at Butler Tech. The $300. will be paid from the Transit Fund. Yes, it's only $300., but that's not the point. It's from a city fund which was funded by the taxpayer and Gilleland made the decision to use our money. These people who are attending sat at the table with the lending institution and signed the papers willingly. They failed to negotiate a payment plan that was within their means and now can't afford what they signed for. Why does the taxpayer have to pay to provide transportion for people who happen to make a bad decision and can't handle it? Isn't this like the United Way in aid, only we taxpayers don't have a choice whether to give or not? OK, the upside is that with this program, it may help some people make adjustments to retain their homes, but the majority, I would think, will lose their homes anyway. I'd like to see, after the event, the number of people who actually rode the busses for these 6 hours and was it a money losing venture for gas and wear and tear on the busses.]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67493,67493#msg-67493</guid>
      <pubDate>Sat, 16 Aug 2008 09:07:18 -0400</pubDate>
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    <item>
      <title>Atrium Taxes</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67488,67488#msg-67488</link>
      <author>Non-AK Worker</author>
      <description><![CDATA[I'm not sure about the latest decision as to where the Atrium sits.  Middletown or Franklin?  Will the employees have to pay Franklin city taxes or Middletown City taxes? Anyone know the tax rate for Franklin?]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67488,67488#msg-67488</guid>
      <pubDate>Fri, 15 Aug 2008 22:44:53 -0400</pubDate>
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    <item>
      <title>And Instead of Taking GE Move to</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67463,67465#msg-67465</link>
      <author>The Watchdog</author>
      <description><![CDATA[West Chester as a major loss, city council will say, &quot;see, we told you so. Cincinnati is growing north, while Dayton grows south. Soon, the only land will be Middletown, the intersection of north and south of the I-75 corridor, and we'll be ready.&quot; Instead, the scrutiny should be, why are we continuing losing opportunities and not given any consideration? Why can't we compete?]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67463,67465#msg-67465</guid>
      <pubDate>Fri, 15 Aug 2008 00:52:15 -0400</pubDate>
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    <item>
      <title>Gone in 60 Seconds...</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67412,67464#msg-67464</link>
      <author>The Watchdog</author>
      <description><![CDATA[well, just as soon as the SunCoke deal is finalized and the constrcution begins in full. 2009 R &amp; D for AKS will be down in West Chester. But maybe, all those engineers will look for a bargain to buy in Middletown housing market, after all, its just a 20 minute drive.]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67412,67464#msg-67464</guid>
      <pubDate>Fri, 15 Aug 2008 00:43:37 -0400</pubDate>
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    <item>
      <title>But Middletown Has Highway Access</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67463,67463#msg-67463</link>
      <author>The Watchdog</author>
      <description><![CDATA[buildings, and all the amenities GE wanted in their selection. Here's what they said they wanted:

&quot;GE spokesman Rick Kennedy said the company chose West Chester Twp. because it offered a location for a new facility, room to expand, interstate access, among other reasons.&quot;

Not quite. The &quot;other reasons&quot; would have included a quality of life, a city willing to maintain streets, and a reputation which would not soil the brand name and corporate image. Middletown wasn't even in the hunt. But, rumor has it Penn Station is looking to expand to a 3rd location and a new Dollar General will be opening soon. Keeping pace is a top priority with the city development office.]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67463,67463#msg-67463</guid>
      <pubDate>Fri, 15 Aug 2008 00:37:59 -0400</pubDate>
    </item>
    <item>
      <title>Does that mean AKS Will then be...</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67412,67430#msg-67430</link>
      <author>the.strategist</author>
      <description><![CDATA[moving their engineers and R &amp; D out of Middletown, because the Middletown facility is quite old, and CAD/ CAM simulation requires considerable bandwidth. With GE's $100K average income engineer going to be down in West Chester, would the Middletown engineers want a new home? I would think so.

Agree with you on the ordinace, longer than O.R.C. and filled with countless contradictions.]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67412,67430#msg-67430</guid>
      <pubDate>Wed, 13 Aug 2008 17:54:59 -0400</pubDate>
    </item>
    <item>
      <title>And the second reason</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67414,67427#msg-67427</link>
      <author>the.strategist</author>
      <description><![CDATA[no meaningful commerical development will occur: cameras which about every other city is SW Ohio views as unconstitutional, mediocre schools, poor leadership w/ reputation for watching out for themselves and their supporters, not their constituents, roads and infrastructure which has been left untouched for two decades, a declining affuency of general population (per capita income on decline), uncertainty about AKS's future (in spite of SunCoke, ie, why bother w/ considering Middletown, a reputation not too friendly w/ neighboring communities, a downtown gone. Drove through Renaissance area on east end, noted not much new building in last 2-3 years. Clayton development not expanding- one occupant- Hospice. If you are going to choose to live on 122, most are choosing Warren Cty east of Fenwick, than Middletown Annex. The tax abatements and Middletown's inability to compete because of the longterm requests is a deal breaker. No way a GE, Ikea, any major company would agree to Middletown's terms.]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67414,67427#msg-67427</guid>
      <pubDate>Wed, 13 Aug 2008 16:30:15 -0400</pubDate>
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    <item>
      <title>Seriously, though...</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67412,67423#msg-67423</link>
      <author>Mike Presta</author>
      <description><![CDATA[Where would we put them???

In one of the dumpy old buildings downtown??  Take it from someone who has been there!!  (I was a Project Manager for McGraw working out of their “historical” complex at First &amp; Clinton back in ‘89 and ‘90.)  I don’t care what the mayor’s wife and the other members of the Council on Landmarks and Hysterical Districts say.  I’m serious as a heart attack (literally) when I tell you that 21st century engineers, especially rocket scientists, are inefficient, uncomfortable, and uncompetitive trying to work in those big, hulking, hot, maze-like, dusty, worn out buildings that are woefully mis-wired and unsuitable for modern applications without zillions of dollars worth of modernization.

To make matters worse, and even more expensive, the major remodeling must be to “historical restoration” standards contained in “the Downtown Middletown Design Guidelines” (a nationally recognized paradigm, I’m sure.)  And of course anything unsightly must be hidden by trees and shrubs approved by the “CITY ARBORIST”!!!  (Didn’t know that we had a “City Arborist”???  Neither did I!!  Perhaps his office is right next to our “FLOODPLAIN ADMINISTRATOR”!!!

Sheesh!!!

Middletown’s ordinances are actually LONGER than the Ohio Revised Code!!!]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67412,67423#msg-67423</guid>
      <pubDate>Wed, 13 Aug 2008 13:56:37 -0400</pubDate>
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    <item>
      <title>Re: Middletown Economic Development Program Manager</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67373,67422#msg-67422</link>
      <author>MiddieNative</author>
      <description><![CDATA[well, sounds like the citizens of Middletown will never win and we are doomed to the same repetitive treatment for years to come.  Its also sad that some only do things because there is prestige involved or are about being recognized and not doing what is right for this town.  Or any other town for that matter...I guess there are a lot of &quot;look at me-s&quot; in this world, not just here.]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67373,67422#msg-67422</guid>
      <pubDate>Wed, 13 Aug 2008 12:58:50 -0400</pubDate>
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    <item>
      <title>Re: Another Lost Opportunity For Revenue-Thanks Bill!</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67412,67420#msg-67420</link>
      <author>Mike Presta</author>
      <description><![CDATA[Ya can't blame Mr. Murphy.  He was too busy hiring more help!

;-)]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67412,67420#msg-67420</guid>
      <pubDate>Wed, 13 Aug 2008 12:25:16 -0400</pubDate>
    </item>
    <item>
      <title>It Is not entirely the person</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67373,67419#msg-67419</link>
      <author>the.strategist</author>
      <description><![CDATA[as Ms. Scott-Jones has been a balanced council member. The rest, well, rather biased in their support of whatever the city wants to do, then fine, lets do it. The problem is the council are tactical, maybe in part because they meet a few times a month, and never are proactive, always reactive. They are always caught behind the 8 ball, with their pants down, unknowing until its too late, as to what has occurred. Its the same composition of people running every cycle. To be truthful, most in Middletown wouldn't want the job. Its not a status position by any means. To wit, the cyle continues, like a record stuck and playing the same tune, over and over.]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67373,67419#msg-67419</guid>
      <pubDate>Wed, 13 Aug 2008 12:17:19 -0400</pubDate>
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    <item>
      <title>Why Meaningful Development Will Not Happen</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67414,67414#msg-67414</link>
      <author>the.strategist</author>
      <description><![CDATA[in Middletown. I wanted to respond and add further to what vette stated about GE. There are two fundamental reasons Middletown will not successfully see commercial development. City is so far behind other communities who rcognized the need to be diverse, grew, and can afford to nurture development longterm. By longeterm, I mean tax abatements. Look at GE, its about 15 years of abatements at $200K on property. Middletown cannot afford that type of deferment, unless the residents make up the difference. That's why the city kept ramming this fool-hardy income tax increases every election cycle. They want the time to make these tax abatements and have the residents pay for it,while business enjoys the tax break.]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67414,67414#msg-67414</guid>
      <pubDate>Wed, 13 Aug 2008 11:02:00 -0400</pubDate>
    </item>
    <item>
      <title>Another Lost Opportunity For Revenue-Thanks Bill!</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67412,67412#msg-67412</link>
      <author>80corvette</author>
      <description><![CDATA[GE Aircraft Tech Center relocating to West Chester. 1400 jobs- $100,000/year average salary. Middletown could use some of those payroll taxes now couldn't they? Mr. Murphy- did you know about this? Did you make an attempt to lure them to the I-75 corridor or was Middletown too far north for them to relocate? Again, for the umteenth time, why don't we hear where Middletown is pursuing opportunities like this? Where is our Economic Development Department?]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67412,67412#msg-67412</guid>
      <pubDate>Wed, 13 Aug 2008 06:59:22 -0400</pubDate>
    </item>
    <item>
      <title>Re: Middletown Economic Development Program Manager</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67373,67411#msg-67411</link>
      <author>80corvette</author>
      <description><![CDATA[You are correct. Alot of people are unhappy with the leadership in this town. Have been for years. When voting time comes around, and you stand there and look at the ballot, you see the same names. When you go to the forums prior to the elections, you see two types of candidates. One type is the good old boy club members that run every election and are voted in due to name recognition. They never accomplish anything while they're in office and have actually contributed over the years to the demise of the town. The other type of candidate is the newcomer. Some of the newcomers are competent and have good ideas and some don't have a clue about facts, figures or how the town is operated. The newcomer group rarily gets elected because of incompetency or because they're good candidates but their vote gets diluted when the good old boy club floods the candidate choices with their own people.]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67373,67411#msg-67411</guid>
      <pubDate>Wed, 13 Aug 2008 06:54:07 -0400</pubDate>
    </item>
    <item>
      <title>Re: I am unsure about which project you folks are speaking...</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67242,67410#msg-67410</link>
      <author>MiddieNative</author>
      <description><![CDATA[It might be possible that the same person who did the numbers for Elderly services levy came up with the numbers for the streets projects. That way Schiavone can have his money to buy all those trees to increase our quality of life.]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67242,67410#msg-67410</guid>
      <pubDate>Wed, 13 Aug 2008 03:51:19 -0400</pubDate>
    </item>
    <item>
      <title>Re: Middletown Economic Development Program Manager</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67373,67407#msg-67407</link>
      <author>MiddieNative</author>
      <description><![CDATA[I've been reading this site for some time now, and the theme stays the same.  Everyone is unhappy with the council members, yet the same ones get elected over and over again...]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67373,67407#msg-67407</guid>
      <pubDate>Wed, 13 Aug 2008 01:12:35 -0400</pubDate>
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    <item>
      <title>Re: The Hot bed of</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67207,67402#msg-67402</link>
      <author>S</author>
      <description><![CDATA[Anon maybe you should look past the home page of the site and actually look at the Blog porton.  Last I looked today there were about 1800 posts in the blog section.]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67207,67402#msg-67402</guid>
      <pubDate>Tue, 12 Aug 2008 19:14:25 -0400</pubDate>
    </item>
    <item>
      <title>Empire Building</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67373,67376#msg-67376</link>
      <author>The Watchdog</author>
      <description><![CDATA[vette, you hit on on spot, that is, nonsense. Bill Murphy has no significant accomplishments, other than the council telling everyone who does little to nothing, they are marvelous. Look at the interim ciy manager. City paid this guy $75K to hire his friend and made an extra $50K to put down on his house in Va. And Mr. Murphy? Spent more time visiting the world, and what afew jobs QC added were tied to abatements. I just cannot comprehend how citizens tolerate this type of &quot;nonsense.&quot; But, the empire building will continue, he resume building continue, and the positioning for the next job continue. Of course, the last development manager who did nothing, Mr. Barielle, retired, and did a few year double-dip down in Hamilton. awarded for his lack of achievement until his wife retired from Miami University. Neyer sued Hamilton, but Middletown and Murphy think they are in good hands. Bill must need a grant writer and some one to run the fort while he's on a European tour. Results would dictate additions in private sector, in city, a few Powerpoint slides, and they'll approve 3-4 new employees. One wonders what the next accomplishment he will take credit for...CBL's failure?]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67373,67376#msg-67376</guid>
      <pubDate>Tue, 12 Aug 2008 08:08:52 -0400</pubDate>
    </item>
    <item>
      <title>Re: The Hot bed of</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67207,67374#msg-67374</link>
      <author>S</author>
      <description><![CDATA[Yeah Anon I see you are breaking all Internet records here on the MJ site 6 or 7 posters since the start of August and half of them also post and read the OTHER site.  Keep up the good work Anon. Stay here in the dark Anon.]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67207,67374#msg-67374</guid>
      <pubDate>Tue, 12 Aug 2008 07:35:24 -0400</pubDate>
    </item>
    <item>
      <title>Middletown Economic Development Program Manager</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67373,67373#msg-67373</link>
      <author>80corvette</author>
      <description><![CDATA[Advertised in today's Journal- the position of Economic Development Program Manager. And--- what will this Program Manager do that Billy Murphy can't do? Is Bill so busy that he has to have a person to manage his work activity? Is there THAT MUCH econ. devel. activity in Middletown proper? I wasn't aware of this beehive of activity, were you? Wonder how much this position will cost the taxpayer and how much sit down in front of a computer time per hour this equates to? I bet Bill has a buddy in mind for this. The nonsense continues.]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67373,67373#msg-67373</guid>
      <pubDate>Tue, 12 Aug 2008 07:20:35 -0400</pubDate>
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    <item>
      <title>The Three Musketeers</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67242,67329#msg-67329</link>
      <author>The Watchdog</author>
      <description><![CDATA[MUM, City of Middletown, and Middletown Journal- the trio, all for one. That's why no matter how bad reality is, the Journal spins it differently. Notice how quickly the article died about the guilty plead of the President of Courtney Duff by Journal, and how that related to selling 11 acres for $200K? Citizens, do yourself a favor. Appeal your tax bill, your property thanks to Middletown leadership, and school failures, is now well below tax value. All the money fr roads going to the Atrium and the east end.]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67242,67329#msg-67329</guid>
      <pubDate>Sun, 10 Aug 2008 13:56:06 -0400</pubDate>
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    <item>
      <title>Re: Nine Miles of Widening</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67242,67310#msg-67310</link>
      <author>80corvette</author>
      <description><![CDATA[Well, how about it Mr. Richter (or any council member). How did the city find $435,000 for this project when you couldn't find $150,000 for the street repairs? Please ask that question on behalf of the people and report your findings, Mr. Richter.You are so quick to write stories to defend the city's position, how about a little investigative reporting on this topic!]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67242,67310#msg-67310</guid>
      <pubDate>Sun, 10 Aug 2008 10:01:10 -0400</pubDate>
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    <item>
      <title>Answer (E) All of the above</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67242,67309#msg-67309</link>
      <author>The Watchdog</author>
      <description><![CDATA[Mike, yes, in my opinion:

1. The city added waste and fat so more could be used in the general fund 2. It would appear some degree of federal funding would be available for complete rehab of the streets which need total demolition and rebuild including sewers.3. The project referenced on first blush appeared to be the &quot;new activity&quot; by the Atrium and rumming towards Red Lion, ie widening.

To me, what is most appalling is the city found nearly $435K in the general fun to match the federal funds, but had a horrifically difficult time (alleged) to come up with about $160,000. for filling dangerous potholes throughout Middletown. That's amost 2.5 times the expenditure, but apparently no one takes exception to this.There are still terrible places on North Breiehel right before the intersection with Manchester. City seems to be unwilling to recognize, is the money spent on one area, the east end, has little impact upon its economy, and more importantly, is recognized by potential home owners, the city is just neglecting the maintenance of its streets and infrastructure. Your point Mr. Presta is well made, would federal funds be available for severe street repair within the west end, as the basis for the expenditures in the east end, was the city needed to take advantage of federal matching funds.]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67242,67309#msg-67309</guid>
      <pubDate>Sun, 10 Aug 2008 09:17:30 -0400</pubDate>
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    <item>
      <title>I am unsure about which project you folks are speaking...</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67242,67302#msg-67302</link>
      <author>Mike Presta</author>
      <description><![CDATA[But, if it is the one approved at the last City Council meeting...

The new FIVE LANE ROADWAY of which you speak does present to us an interesting study relevant to the rehabilitation of Middletown’s existing 594+ lane-miles of roadway.

I offer the following for your consideration:

1.  To total projected cost for the rehabilitation of 594+ lane-miles of existing roadway (hereafter called the “Rehab”) in Middletown is estimated to be between $120,000,000 and $130,000,000, or about $210,000/lane-mile.  (I realize that these figures are not exact. PLEASE do not nit-pick, but try to consider the POINT!!!  Re-calculate the figures to whatever degree of accuracy tickles your fancy, and then correct me while I am out of town!!!  That goes for all that follows!)

2.  As near as I can decipher from the info I have available, the “WOODS CREEK DRIVE” Project (hereafter called the “Project”) scope is a green field project consisting of about 1,500 feet of new, five-lane roadway, equaling 1.405 lane-miles of new pavement for $873,518, or about $615,956/lane-mile.

3.  The Project scope includes (or at least it should include): 

3 a. clearing and grubbing; grading; removal of any unacceptable sub-grade; providing, placing and compacting engineered fill; trenching for sewer, water, and other underground utilities; placing bedding for utilities; supplying and installing utilities and laterals to limits of R-O-W; testing utilities; constructing/installing manholes, catch basins, fire hydrants, shut-off valves and the like; backfilling utilities.

3b. Supplying and installing gravel sub-base.

3c.  Supplying, placing and compacting asphaltic concrete base course. 

3d.  Supplying, placing and compacting asphaltic concrete intermediate course(s).

3e.  Supplying, placing and compacting asphaltic concrete surface (wear) course, paint lane markings, etc.

3f.  Constructing curbs, gutters, driveway aprons.

3g.  Supply and install road signage, lighting, control devices.

3h.  Landscaping (probably includes many expensive flowers and TREES, and “historic” paraphernalia.) 

4.  Now, think about rehab!

4a.  Many neighborhood streets need only crack sealing and seal-coating.

4b.  A majority of other streets presently need only removal of the top inch or two of asphalt followed by “3e.” above.  (Supplying, placing and compacting asphaltic concrete surface (wear) course, paint lane markings, etc.)  Plus some spotty removal and replacement of subgrade and base and intermediate courses.

4c.  Only a few streets need complete removal and replacement (items 3b, 3c, 3d, and 3e above).

5.  Only the worst of the worst streets need EVERYTHING above, including storm/sanitary sewers, but that is because they must be torn up to REPLACE undersized, substandard COMBINED sewers.  These streets should fall under “enterprise funds” and also federal and state programs, and therefore should NOT be included in the Rehab budget.

Don’t ask me why the “subcommittees” didn’t consider any of this.  I have my opinion why, but my opinions didn’t matter then, so they won’t matter now.

I guess I said all of that just to say this:

Did we really put enough thought into the estimate that arrived at the $120 to $130 MILLION estimate?  Or was someone “encouraged” to throw in a lot of “fat” so that there would be plenty of money to “TUCK AWAY in some of our OTHER funds??

I can still find NO reason to trust this council!!!]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67242,67302#msg-67302</guid>
      <pubDate>Sun, 10 Aug 2008 04:18:54 -0400</pubDate>
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    <item>
      <title>East End-Net Sum Gain or Loss?</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67242,67251#msg-67251</link>
      <author>the.strategist</author>
      <description><![CDATA[80corvetee, you beat me to starting the blog, I was thinking the same. At the end of the day, Middletown will see a net sum loss in the east end &quot;investment.&quot; The move killed the residents around the hospital and peripheral subdivisions. Physicians new to the area won't be moving to Middletown, they will be living elsewhere. Same with most medical personnel. The Atrium's reputation as a place to work is actually lower than it was when it was just Middletown Hospital. While the hype continues, city continues to lose businesses. All the focus on the east end at the west ends detriment. Streets look just horrible. Spoke to one of top local brokers recently who said used to be those working in Cincy or Dayton might look at Middletown for value; not anymore. Amazing city always finds a way to get Perry Thatcher's property leased, ie, school district, now MUM. Well, Ms. Mulligan will be pleased, Larry will ensure Fenwick High School has mint four lane access to accommodate its sought growth. Perhaps city could invest in rolling the city building out there and placing it on Neyer's development. When Genetech, Lilly, or Ohio State opens a medical school there, the hye hasn't matched reality.Middletown looks like they might try annexing all the way to Red Lion, maybe tear down Hunter for other &quot;non profits.&quot;]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67242,67251#msg-67251</guid>
      <pubDate>Sat, 09 Aug 2008 11:17:29 -0400</pubDate>
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    <item>
      <title>Nine Miles of Widening</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67242,67247#msg-67247</link>
      <author>the anonymous donor</author>
      <description><![CDATA[vette, this article was just Ed Richter doing his usual rah rah in advance of complaints which will be coning from residents about $435,000 in money used for the &quot;project&quot; when it (city) complained non-stop about having to scrap the barrel for $150K to fill potholes. The problem with Middletown ldrs is they sell themselves and their mutual projects, not the city nor their citizens. While this rah rah is being circulated by ER and others, the citizens west of 75 are getting left with the continued plummenting home sales, depressed property valuation, and continued poor schools. What's going to be on the Atrium campus? A hospital, a Y, a few minor trade schools, and a check processing entity. We have heard about this for years now with no new &quot;add-ons&quot;. The extra wide paveent runs nicely into Warren Cty. Who benefits? The winners are the Atrium, so McNeil can tap into Warren Cty at Middletown's expense, and Fenwick. The growth of Fenwick will take place, from Lebanon,Springboro, and West Chester-not Middletown. For yers the sizzle has been attempted to be sold, not the steak. The taste of the steak isn't good. The losers are the residents of Middletown...as usual. Branding? No, branded, and saddled with ldrs selling themselves, not their citizens and community.]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67242,67247#msg-67247</guid>
      <pubDate>Sat, 09 Aug 2008 10:48:11 -0400</pubDate>
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    <item>
      <title>Activity In The East End</title>
      <link>http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67242,67242#msg-67242</link>
      <author>80corvette</author>
      <description><![CDATA[Article in the Journal-Sat- Aug 9- By April of 2009, Murphy and the city leaders say we are going to see a flurry of activity around the hospital area. We're going to see new partners around the hospital, new ramps and widening of roads and the &quot;branding&quot; of the area where &quot;innovation meets opportunity&quot;. All of this activity sounds great and will be healthy growth for a city that needs all the healthy activity it can get. Let's bookmark this article for future reference  and bring this article to their attention at the end of next year if none of this takes place. Now, I wouldn't need to make that statement with the degree of skepticism that I do, if their track record of not doing what they say they're going to do didn't occur so often. IE- I'll believe it when I see it.]]></description>
      <category>Middletown City Council</category>
      <guid isPermaLink="true">http://discussions.oxfordpress.com/read.php?80,67242,67242#msg-67242</guid>
      <pubDate>Sat, 09 Aug 2008 09:20:39 -0400</pubDate>
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